High Prey Drive and Cats - Advice needed

[rabelro]

Hi All,

I am new to this forum and have joined to get some advice please.

We adopted Harry at the end of October 2014.  
We love him to bits and he is the most easy dog in all respects.

However we have a problem with Cats.

We are lucky enough to have a large garden that is fenced off so he can play off the lead.  Playing fetch with a tennis ball is his favorite past time.

When we rehomed him he was "cat safe" which I know doesn't mean much.  However he showed far too much interest in our elderly cat so we kept them separated.  She was poorly and we knew on borrowed time.

Our neighbor has 2 elderly cats, one of which I have never seen in the 10 years we have lived here, the other used to come in our garden on occasions.

We always check in the garden before letting him out just to make sure neither cat is around.

Unfortunately I was getting some wood in a few months ago and next doors cat came in our kitchen.  You can imagine what happened next.  I did manage to separate them eventually and got the cat to the vet.  Unfortunately the cat had to be put down.   The neighbor was very understanding and said that he didn't think he was going to live much longer anyway ( he was 16) and as he was very arthritic so wouldn't have been able to run away.  We of course paid the vets bills and no more was said.

About 4 weeks after this for some inexplicable reason while I was in the garden with Harry, our cat then decided to come out in the garden.  She is a tiny thing and it was over before I could get near to intervene.  I checked she was in the house before I went out.

On the lead he is always muzzled (and will continue to be!) and shows interest in squirrels/rabbits but does not pull or try to chase.  I don't even have to say no, he just seems to know not to do it on the lead.

We are on guard just in case in the garden but there are no other cats living near us at this time, so I have not investigated options to help at this point.

My Neighbor came to see us last week and said his other cat only has a few weeks to live, and he is getting 2 more cats.  He wants to know what we are going to do about it.

So this is my dilemma - what do we do about it ?

He would like the dog chained up at all times in the garden which I don't think is an option as I am sure if the cat came in Harry would try to chase it and strangle himself.
I thought about him being muzzled the whole time is out in our garden but that would mean we can't play ball with him.
I have thought about adding a bell to his collar to give them a warning.
But i keep thinking that any of these options are just an accident waiting to happen.  He could still injure one of them with a muzzle on.

It would be a very unhappy situation if when the neighbor gets the cats something where to happen.

He has said that he has lived here 30 years and it has always been a safe environment for cats until now.  So although he was OK about the initial situation with his cat, he is clearly already thinking about what he would do next time.

I have every sympathy with him, and do not want to end up in this situation.  I was mortified when it happened and naively assumed we would not have to deal with it as there were no other cats!

Any advice gratefully received.  Please do not pass comment on what has already happened it was a horrible, stressful time and all I want to do is find a workable way to avoid it without taking Harry back.

Thank you 

Harrys Mum 

[sallyannh]

Hi,

I'm sorry for all the unpleasantness, horrible for all concerned. What I'm about to say probably isn't that helpful, but it is my twopennorth worth.

Harry is a dog. Dogs chase cats. Greyhounds can chase cats a bit faster than most other dogs. Many dogs of all breeds live happily with cats but will chase strange cats in their garden. I think that you need to tactfully advise your neighbour that you will continue to keep Harry confined in the garden, you will continue to muzzle him when you walk him and you will not let him off lead in unenclosed spaces. You are being a responsible pet owner. It is now up to him to be the same, and to think carefully about his pet-owning plans. If he is still insistent he wants cats, then it is up to him to stop them wandering into your garden. Please don't muzzle Harry in the garden (he could still damage a cat while wearing a muzzle) and certainly don't chain him up - how short would your neighbour like the chain to be to enable his cats to roam freely on your property? Even if he doesn't get more cats, you will probably find that other local cats expand their territory.

Please don't think I am in any way anti-cat. I love them and have owned them myself in the past. However, when our old Moggy died a few years back part of my decision not to have another cat was the whole anti-social aspect. There's also the worry of traffic, sadistic nutters, foxes... my female cat disappeared shortly after she bought an adder into our house, she was probably bitten. You either let them roam the neighbourhood and make a nuisance of themselves, (messing in gardens, nicking goldfish out of ponds and fighting all comers very noisily, etc, etc), or keep them confined to the house which is difficult, and in my mind, quite cruel. However, I go on a website with a lot of american contributors, and they view our practice of letting our cats roam freely as cruel and irresponsible. Some people I know have built cat runs attached to their house with lots of toys, climbing posts, etc, I don't know if this would be feasible for your neighbour.

Both of our greys will chase cats if given the chance. I have managed to call Darcy off one in the garden once (possibly my proudest moment as a greyhound Mum) but Roma still goes potty when she sees a cat, even when walking on the lead. I have tried all the usual remedies but once she sees a cat she's 'in the zone' and I could probably set fire to her tail without her noticing it! I love her to bits though. My opposite neighbour has 4 cats and on the whole, they've got the message about not coming in our garden. My neighbour is aware of the dangers, but then another neighbour has a Weinmarer that also chases cats so it's not just my dogs.

Please don't give Harry up if he suits you in all other ways. Another neighbour could just as easily get a cat-chasing Spaniel or poodle which could inflict just as much damage as Harry. It really is your neighbour's responsibility to keep his cats out of your garden. Perhaps you could tell him that you found the incident where Harry got his cat so traumatic (which I appreciate it was) that you would like him to take steps to prevent it happening again.

[katie]

I totally agree with the response posted, having owned up to 4 cats myself in the past, cats roam that's what they do, and as an owner it's yours decision whether you keep them as house cats or not. If not losing them is the risk you take particularly when they roam into neighbours gardens, I would never have expected my neighbours to not have dogs because my cats roam!
Don't give up on Harry if your neighbour chooses to keep cats that's their choice, just as much as you choose to keep a hound.

[suethejam]

I always find this difficult - I don't want cats to die but neither do I want to restrict my hounds in their own home - it's the one place they can relax and be themselves. I wouldn't muzzle them in our garden any more than I wouldn't drive my car on our road (where cats frequently roam).

There is "cat proof fencing" which is designed to restrict cats to their own gardens. I'd contemplate that for my garden, but it is designed for use by cat owners to keep them in rather than dog owners to keep them out.

[leigh1571]

I agree and i thinks cats should have pen's in the garden for them to go in.

[sueb]

Hi Harry's Mum

I agree with all the above comments, and I do sympathise.

Nellie had a very high prey drive, when we first got her, was horrendous with any small furriers. Although she's impeccably behaved now with small dogs, her and Brennan still chase any cats from the garden.

Most cats have the sense to keep away, but I am driven mad more recently with a couple of very persistent cats, who spit at me in my garden, and use it as their personal toilet, and Brennan eats their poo- v unpleasant for us when we come to clean his teeth! So, I’m always thinking of ways to try and keep cats out.

I think it’s unreasonable to expect you to muzzle or restrain your dogs because of other peoples cats coming into your garden, it’s a bit like saying it’s a drivers fault if a cat gets runs over, if it runs straight out in front of a car! Or even if a child climbed into another garden and drowned in someone else’s pond, the law would not hold that person responsible.

Having said that, I like cats and would be very upset if my 2 caught one, so I do go with them when they go into the garden, make a lot of noise when opening the door, so to warn cats to scarper. I also hold onto their collars while I give the garden a quick reccie before letting them go. (The one time I let them out before checking, Nellie gave chase and ended up cutting 3 paws/legs, so had to go straight off to the vets!)

We have also bought (although yet to put up) some strips of spikes, which you put on top of fences, to deter cats. They are not very sharp, rather they are uncomfortable for them if they put their feet on. We are also going to put some netting up higher than the shed roof, as they come in that way, (but with things attached so the cats can see it’s there and don’t get caught in it!) I’ve tried putting citrus skins on the earth, (which cats hate, apparently) and sprinkling eucalyptus oil on the tops of fences, but with very limited success.

I think Sally’s advice (last sentence of her post) is good. If you were willing to do things like e.g. holding onto Harry’s collar to look and make sure there were no cats in the garden before letting him go, you could tell your neighbour that’s more than reasonable, but he has to also make reasonable compromise. Ultimately he may say it’s in a cats nature to wander, but it’s also in a greyhounds to chase/catch prey, so given this he needs to make decision about his cats being let out (especially any new ones he gets).
Good luck, let us know how you get on.

[patshep]

Please do not return Harry.

I agree with all the advice given

While it is your responsibility to keep your garden and fencing dogproof, your neighbour likewise has to take the same precautions for his cats on his own property. If he goes ahead and gets two more cats without doing this and knowing the risks, then he must accept total responsibility for them.

[rabelro]

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for all your advice. There are a few ideas that I had not thought of which might help

I love the idea of spikes on the fence, it might keep out the squirrels!

I am going to make a list of what we can reasonably do, and ask the he also take some responsibility and accepts that there is a risk.

I'll keep you posted on what he says

[patshep]

I use a strip like a 'bed of nails', although it is made of heavy duty plasticwhich is screwed on top of the fence. I can't exactly remember the name, somethink like prikka stic. I do know I got them from Kleeneze, although Betterware also have them. One pack just about does one fence. They were £9.99 so can be quite pricey if you have a long garden. Sorry to be so vague but I bought mine about 5 years ago.

[sueb]

We got our strips from Screwfix.

www.screwfix.com/p/stv-poison-free-defenders-prickle-strip-fence-top-l-shape-pest-deterrent/27620

[gail]

We are quite lucky as Ben does not chase cats, but when we first got him we muzzled him in the garden for a few weeks just in case, so that any cats were aware he was here. But it is YOUR private garden, and I think that if you can check no cats are in the garden before letting the dog out then you are doing all you can. I don't think it is fair to muzzle him in his own space. My friends Labradors killed a deer in their garden, which was horrible, but unfortunately animals will be animals.

[codiesmum]

Hi All, found this thread to be very helpful. Thank you. I rehomed a greyhound back at the end of February, and he's certainly got "issues". He is so cat-aggressive - and finally, on Friday, this aggression ended up with my boy killing next door's cat. Extremely distressing situation to witness and to have to go and tell the neighbour. I tried everything that I could to get Codie to release the cat but to no avail. By the time he did release it, after I'd thwacked him over the rump with the rubber sole of my slipper, it was too late and the cat crawled off to die in my entrance porch. Incredibly stressful to deal with - so I do empathise with anyone who's also experienced this. Thankfully, the neighbour was very kind about it and, whilst very upset, she did realise that it was just a matter of bad timing. The cat had been coming into my garden for the last 4.5 years and dumping in the flower beds. Unfortunately he just picked the wrong time, on this occasion. I always keep Codie on a leash and muzzled when out in public but do not do so when he is in his own garden. Still feel terrible about it and just know that the neighbour the other side, once he gets wind of it, will mandate that I make the wall between our two gardens higher. I've already had metal trellis fabricated to do so but am now struggling to find someone to help me fit it. I live alone, with bad Rheumatoid A. and am a woman "of a certain age". Feel pretty alone with this doggy - it's been a rough ride since I got him. Such a shame, but think I can now understand why he's been bounced as often as he has. (Unfortunately I did not know this prior to adopting him - I was told he had gone out twice and on one of the returns it was not his fault.) Dogs Trust were somewhat economical with the truth where my boy is concerned. :-( Codies Mum

[suethejam]

Codiesmum: I've seen both of your posts this evening and I'm sorry that you're having such a hard time. The cat issue is very difficult but I do feel that it was his garden and he has a right to be there! I really hope that the behaviourist can help with some pracical solutions. Some hounds can take a lot of time to settle, they have a lot to learn and for some it doesn't come easy.

I hope that it doesn't come to this, but if you feel that you can't manage your boy then please give him back to a rescue and please don't have him put to sleep - somewhere there is the right home for Cody and the right hounds for you.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you both...

[katie]

Hi Codiesmum I have just been speaking to Pat on another matter and mentioned your post to her, please feel free to give her a call she will be able to help you. Her number is 01708 551689.

[jofisher]

I have been reading these posts about Greyhounds and cats.  

I am very angry over the neighbour who has told you he plans to get some new cats and asks what are you going to do about your greyhound, damn cheek!

It is his responsibility to keep his cats out of your garden, not yours, and Greyhounds are natural chasers.  If he had knocked on my door I would have really given him a piece of my mind, and maybe asked what he was going to do about his cats pooing in my garden???

I am not a cat lover, although I would never hurt one.  Ollie does not like cats either and has chased them from our garden.

I so hope things turn out ok for you. I would never give up on Ollie if a neighbour asked me my plans for him if he was getting cats.  My reply would be "Ollie was here first so give it a rest and maybe consider another pet, Ollie is going nowhere"!

Best wishes

Jo and Ollie (Pickapocketortwo)

xx

Please do not give him up, I think you would be heartbroken the minute you did.  Please let us know how things are going.X

I wonder if there is something you can get to deter cats from your garden??  Also, how about trying to introduce cat and dog in a safe environment, maybe muzzle your dog and keep him on a lead and put the cat in a basket and keep the meeting habit up over a long time and reward the dog for good behaviour.  I  dont know how friendly you are with your neighbour, but I feel you should express how much you love your dog and want things to work out all round.